Dinner for Fiends: Occupy Two and a Half

At long, long, long, long, long, long, long last… Dinner for Fiends has returned with a two-hour epic-sized edition with a lot of ground to cover jam-packed with spoiler-riffic discussions of the last three months of horror movie and television and all the sniping and snarking you love or hate or love to hate.

Yeah, we’re really late with this show. But we all have good excuses. Fini and I both got hit with hurricanes in the time since the last show. Uncle Creepy’s appendix exploded and nearly killed him. Buz and Andrew, well, they don’t really have any excuses. Since we haven’t done one since September, we have a whole lot of ground to cover. How much ground? Here are just a few of the topics we either briefly touch upon or discuss in-depth (i.e., heavy spoilers):

Bait 3D
Resident Evil: Retribution 3D
Dredd 3D
House at the End of the Street
Hotel Transylvania
Beyond the Black Rainbow
Paranormal Activity 4
Silent Hill: Revelations 3D
Among Friends
The Bay
The Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn – Part 2

Plus, the new seasons of “The Walking Dead”, “Supernatural”, and “American Horror Story” are debated.

A super-sized edition of Dinner For Fiends that is as spirited as it is overdue, particularly when we get to Paranormal Activity 4 and… well… you’ll just have to listen for yourself.

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  • aliensharkboy

    I’m definitely team Malibu Shark Attack over Bait 3D… while, same as Buz, a flooding/tsunami trapping people in some grand scale set with sharks IS my dream movie, Bait 3D just didn’t work for me.

    Speaking of shark films, is the Shark Alarm a reference to that German Megalodon film? Because I’d love to know at which point you guys first discussed that movie! (I have somehow been oblivious to the fact these awesome podcasts existed since I joined… trying to catch up)

    • nazo

      Mediterranean Shark Attack


      • aliensharkboy

        LOL God, I love that film. No joke, it’s got some of my favorite shark action… and I don’t say that lightly.

        But do we know what point they started saying it on Dinner for Fiends? I’d love to hear them discuss the movie.

  • Terminal

    Man if you guys liked Retribution, you should pay me twenty bucks to jingle keys in front of your face for ninety minutes. You’d probably be just as impressed.

    P.S. Glad Creepy didn’t die. Seriously. I hope you live to see a hundred.

  • conundrum

    I so need to start watching things upon which you spew hate, I am off of the same track as most of you apparently. I like Sinister (not love, like). Does it have some big problems? Yeah, but it was still a lot of fun for me. It is a weird mixture of J-horror, found footage, and torture porn. Is the ending painfully telegraphed? Oh HELL yeah, but the journey was still mostly fun for me. While it never hit “Woman in Black” carriage-in-the-marsh level for me, I dreaded hearing that damn projector. And the videos of the previous families were as close to torture porn as I am willing to get and call “entertaining.” Each new one just got more messed up.

    And I do not know how Buz is the only one on the same page with me about Andrea on “The Walking Dead.” This is actually the first time I have heard people who watch the show NOT say how she is the worst character (now that Lori is dead). I understand why she wants to stay in Woodbury (because the writers suck, but less than season 2), it’s more that she follows assholes (Shane and The Governor, but to be fair they were the ones making sense despite being assholes), is whiny, gave a suicidal girl a sharp object (nobody can convince me that was a good thing. NOBODY), constantly rebels in the dumbest possible ways, and is pretty poorly acted.

    And I just cannot get into American Horror Story. No matter how many people tell me it is crazy and awesome and amazing, I watch it, get bored with its tedium and stupidity, then listen to people heap praise onto how fantastic it is. Did you guys really have nothing good to say about “Sinister” but find nothing wrong with this show?

    And as much as Foy made “Twilight” sound not horrendous (dare I say, cool?), I am still sticking with my gut on this one and avoiding it.

    I am curious about seeing “Bait,” though. Comparisons to “Deep Blue Sea” are always welcome in my book.

    • The Buz

      She is awful. Absolutely awful. Putting weight on one leg, extending your hip out, cocking your head, and delivering a poorly written quip does not make you a bad ass. She has three levels, weird power hungry seductress, Sassy mean queen bee, or crying scared.

      Sorry there is not a single other level to her character. It goes beyond bad writing and direction at this point. She has consistently made poor choices as an actress with her character to the point where when she comes on screen I want to fast forward so I can actually get through an episode fully enjoying it.

      Seriously I would love for those of you out there who think she’s great explain to me how she is making correct performance decisions? I’m not talking character, I’m talking acting wise. WHAT THE FUCK ABOUT HER PISS POOR PERFORMANCE CAN YOU POSSIBLY DEFEND?!

    • The Woman In Black

      I was fairly lukewarm on AHS at the beginning of this season, but ever since the “Anne Frank” episodes, I’ve been loving it. Knowing each season has its own arc with a definite ending makes it even better. Lange is amazing as ever, but the other returning cast members really stepped up this year, too, especially Quinto, Paulson, and Rabe. And the camera work has been incredible – I told Buz he needs to check it out.

  • MonsterMash

    Yeah. Good to hear you’re alright Creepy.

    • nazo


      I agree with Foy, in theory, about Adam Sandler. It’s a lot easier to be funny and sympathetic as an awkward underdog than a socially maladjusted rich dude. In practice, I don’t think Sandler’s movies were ever good..

      Given that you guys talked about 20 movies, it seems wrong to complain about skipping one, particularly since it wasn’t horror by any stretch of the imagination, but I was wondering about the DFF consensus on Looper (easily the best thing I’ve watched this year, imo).

      I also don’t understand the hate for Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. It’s not a great movie, but it’s solid, and does a good job of capturing the arbitrary, and somewhat psychotic, tone of the book.

      • The Buz

        Kasch and I LOVED Looper.

        Can’t speak for anyone else, but yeah we both really dug it. Funny too because I actually did want to mention it. Oh well though.

        And don’t understand all the hate? I don’t understand the love.

        The forced performance by Depp. The forced production design. The forced down our throats back story. Depp’s teeth…the whole obsession with teeth.

        And I swear to god if I have to hear one more person say “Well you just never read the book…it’s closer!”

        No it’s not. I’ve read the book. It’s a fine piece of work, but really it’s most interesting in the sense that it’s the only Dahl book to feature children as the bad guys (most of his work comprised of adults always being the bad guys). Burton’s remake does little to capture the tone of the book and more or less comes off as a hustle.

        It has as much to do with Dahl’s book as Jurassic Park does with it’s source novel. And if someone used “You just haven’t read the book…” on someone who didn’t like Jurassic Park…they’d be slapped right in the mouth.

        The movie is built for pretentious Burton fans who just love the meatless Turkey burger garbage he spews out. There was a time and place for Burton’s aesthetic, but even in his heyday his movies weren’t exactly a shining beacon of story and plot. Fun: yes. Enjoyable: totally. Cinema Classics: No, save for a select few (if someone says Batman I’m going to force choke them then shove a Prince album of their choosing up their ass.)

        Are there some good things in the movie? ….You know I actually sat here desperately thinking about cool things in the movie and I just can’t. I always try my best to lay out even critiques on things because not everything can be bad on a movie…but all I can think of is it was cool seeing Christopher Lee and I guess it had good continuity?

        I urge almost all of you to watch it again. I gave it 3 goddamn shots to win me over and each time I hated it more and more. I find it maliciously awful.

        Wow…I haven’t gone off on an internet rant in awhile. I’m going to go back to watching Red Letter Media videos, quoting them as if they are my own thoughts and growing out my neck beard.

        FML, Kirk Out.

        • nazo

          “Love” is a bit strong, I’d give it about a 3/5. I agree about the teeth and the backstory, that was pretty awful, but it meant Christopher Lee was on screen, which blunted the horribleness.

          I don’t think children are the sole bad guys in the book. In my reading of the book, Willy Wonka is built up as this God-like figure, and as Charlie makes his way through the factory, you realize that his god is nothing more than a sadistic, fucked-up, overgrown child. (Prometheus!) If you really stop and think about the story, Willy Wonka is pretty much one step removed from Jigsaw. I thought the Burton movie did a really good job of capturing that. I could have done without the backstory and Wonka’s redemption, but whatever.

          I didn’t hate the production design, or the Burton aesthetic. There are many movies of his I have not seen, so maybe if I watched all of them, I’d start to hate it, I don’t know. I did like the music, and Deep Roy as all of the Oompa Loompas, fwiw.

          The only Burton movie I’ve seen that I unreservedly love is Ed Wood.

        • LSD Zombie

          How did your childhood friends react when you told them Burton’s Batman blows ass? Lol! Watching the ’89 Batman film is one of my greatest childhood memories! Sure, the Prince music had no reason to be in there. Does it ruin the film entirely? Not in my opinion. Danny Elfman’s awesome score more than makes up for Prince. The same goes for the production design, the Batman suit, Keaton, Nicholson, and dialog that is far more memorable and quotable than anything in the Nolan films. I also love Returns.

          Never rub another man’s rhubarb!

          • Terminal

            Burton’s Batman sucks so much ass, it’s not even funny. Burton clearly loves the Joker so he spends so much time focusing on the Joker, and spends very little time developing Batman and Bruce Wayne. Not to mention Batman and Joker don’t actually meet up until the final scenes, and even then it’s anti-climactic. Burton turned DC’s Batman in to his own piece of crap monsters.

            There’s even less focus on Batman in Batman Returns. It’s a Batman movie and the opening isn’t even about Batman! It’s about the origin of the Penguin! And why is the Penguin a deformed mutant again?! Why does Pee Wee Herman make a cameo?

            Oh, lol, it’s just Burton being eccentric, that genius! Fuck off.

            Besides, Batman’s intro is one of the suckiest superhero intros of any comic book movie ever made. Bruce just sits in his office in the dark looking off into space until he’s called in to fight crime? Seriously? And how does no one notice the huge assembly of lights that shine the bat signal in to his house?

            Thank goodness for Nolan.

          • The Buz

            Thank god I’m not alone.

            First off as a movie, Batman fails. It’s dumb soulless action with some cool for the time production design and a killer score.

            As a Batman movie, it fails even harder. Why the fuck does Joker have a back story? Why is Joe Schnell suddenly joker and the one who killed Batman’s parents? Why is Vicky Vale just there to prove Bruce Wayne is heterosexual? Why the fuck is Bruce Wayne sleeping upside down? Alfred does literally almost nothing except show Vicky Vale the bat cave…for little to no reason. The list goes on…

            There are so many goddamn things wrong with Batman I have trouble wrapping my head around it. Batman and Robin is a closer adaptation to the comics than the first one is, and even more so than Batman Returns, which admittedly I do find a tad entertaining due almost entirely to Christopher Walken.

            Also…WHY IS IT OKAY FOR BATMAN TO JUST FUCKING KILL PEOPLE!!? His entire character is built upon THAT FUCKING RULE. Also…no Gordon.

            Not to mention the lack of detective work which is odd since the movie is about THE WORLD’S GREATEST GODDAMN DETECTIVE.

            Great production and costume design(*snort neck turn*) do not equal a good movie. Fuck ’89 Batman.

          • Terminal

            The big fight scene in “Batman Returns” is so fucking retarded. They’re having a huge party with the mayor and major political officials and there are NO police?! And suddenly they all wreak havoc until Batman has to come in and do the dirty work? And let’s not even focus on how Commissioner Gordon is as useless as an asshole on a chin in the original Batman movies. There’s no dynamic.

            And Michael Keaton is piss poor casting. Make all the rationalization you want, he sucked as Bruce. Wrong build, wrong performer, wrong everything. It was Burton casting his friends yet again and not taking any chances. It’s the same thing he does now with Depp and his wife. If Burton had the reins to the Batman movies today, he’d cast Johnny Depp as Bruce Wayne.

            Burton spent the first film forcing the Vale romance down our throats to convince us Bruce is straight, then spent the sequel providing a somewhat interesting romance, and Schumacher dashes in and completely destroys it by making Bruce and Dick Grayson a bickering superhero duo with blatant sexual tension.

            Granted, the Batman movies of the nineties have their problems, but the dumbest scene that just infuriates me is the scene where Kidman summons Batman in “Forever,” and the commissioner appears in his pajamas wondering who set off the bat signal.

            What, was he sleeping at the fucking police station?!


          • LSD Zombie

            I never believed that the 89′ Batman film is perfect, far from it actually. Let me first start with your Joker criticism. Yes, it is true that when The Joker was first introduced, he did not have a backstory. It wasn’t until Alan Moore’s The Killing Joke which turned The Joker into a tragic figure whose luck simply sucked. The backstories for comic book characters have always been changing. Sometimes for the better, sometimes not. In Burton’s case, replacing Joe Chill (not Schnell) with Jack Napier/Joker was a creative decision that made it more of a personal mission for Bruce Wayne/Batman to hunt him down. I wasn’t bothered by it. Would I have preferred the Alan Moore version? Absolutely.

            Now onto Vicki Vale. What purpose did Rachel Dawes serve in both Nolan films? She was the damsel in distress. Granted, I’m not saying Vicki Vale served anymore of a purpose, I’m just making comparisons of equality. Plus, the chemistry between Holmes and Bale was completely unconvincing. Same goes for Gylenhaal.

            Okay, Batman killed one black guy in the ’89 film! But he also did not bother to save Ra’s al Ghul in Begins. You could make the case that not saving someone is not the same as murder, but I think that’s bullshit.

            Like I said, I don’t think the ’89 film is perfect. But for the time being, Burton’s films are the only ones that embraced the comic book look and in my opinion are still pretty damn fun to watch. And by the way, the artistic look of Gotham in the Burton films were pretty much transplanted into the video games. So it’s clear he did something right.

          • Terminal

            He chose not to save Ra’s. That’s not murder. You can try to bring down Nolan’s films to the level of Burton’s paltry excuses, and you’d fail.

          • LSD Zombie

            From a moral perspective, I think the difference is negligible.

          • LifeMi

            He left Ra’s to die; that’s no better than throwing the Joker off the church in Batman ’89. They’re both murder. Personally, I’ve grown to find Nolan’s films overrated. Yes, The Dark Knight is phenomenal, but the third act drags a bit and feels underwhelming in places. Speaking of underwhelming, The Dark Knight Rises was enjoyable and well made, but nothing special. And Batman Begins…I will never understand why people love that movie. That’s not to say Burton is better; I grew up loving Batman ’89, but now I have a hard time getting over a lot of the things Buz touched on (Joker murdering Bruce’s parents, Batman’s lack of heroism) and won’t even watch Batman Returns. I’d say Arkham Asylum and Arkham City’s cut scenes capture the spirit of the Batman universe, and are more fun to watch, than any of the live action films.

          • The Buz

            Fuck me for writing Schnell. I should feel bad. And I do.

            As for Joker back story garbage, even Alan Moore says that his version of The Joker is just one more crazy lie from the man himself. Joker has no back story.

            And the whole thing with it being a personal mission for Bruce Wayne…that’s just bullshit action romanticism. The whole basis of the character is that he is quite literally insane because he can NEVER fulfill his lust for justice because he can never enact it truly onto Joe Chill. This is the very essence of Batman and what drives him to do what he does.

            In every single Comic arc that feature Joe Chill, Batman discovers who he is, and his current whereabouts (usually small time crime boss, hitman, etc…) and before he can do anything about Chill is either murdered or escapes before Bruce/Batman has time to do any thing.

            So in Burton’s Batman, Batman finds out Joker killed his parents then throws him off a roof. Done. He doesn’t need to be Batman anymore. poof. That’s that.

            And yeah Batman leaves Ra’s to die. But he didn’t pull a trigger, didn’t stick a bomb down his belt, or throw him off a roof.

            To me, still Batman. And not just a highly stylized no substance summer movie.

            And seriously…Joker dances to Prince. LOLWUT?

            And you want something that embraces the comic book look? Batman the Animated Series. Boom. Also Batman: Mask of The Phantasm.

            Incredible Batman stories that blow the fuck out of Burton’s films, and to some degree Nolan’s universe as well.

            And are you talking about the Arkham video games? So Burton’s movies embraced the comic book look but the games transplant the look of Burton’s movies but not the comics? Not for nothing but besides a few references to the burton movies (namely the big cat head from Returns) Gotham city is pretty much lifted right out of the comics (Modern Age Batman 1987-).

            Oh and I do completely agree with you on Rachel Dawes. She’s a Fridged character. Serves no other purpose than to be killed and cause our male antagonist angst.

            That being said, that is a flaw in an otherwise fantastic film(s). In Burton’s is just one more on top of the pile of grandiose shit.

          • Terminal

            Dawes served more of a purpose in The Dark Knight than Vicky Vale, Selina Kyle, and Chase Meridian and Julie Madison, the latter two of whom were merely just beards for Bruce at that point.

            For me the Animated series aced it, as did the movies, while Nolan’s live action films were the definitive adaptation.

            Give me British bald Bane over veiny dumb ass Bane who walks around muttering “Boom” every second any day.

          • AngryChairr

            Can I choose neither version of Bane? The Dark Knight Rises is a godawful mess. It has some great moments but overall it’s just not the experience people have made it out to be. Nolan got bogged down in the sociopolitical bullshit he was only hinting at in The Dark Knight, or he just didn’t handle it as well as he did in that film. The jabs at Occupy, glossing over Batman’s own fascist tendencies to make Bane look evil, and the whole “hey guys, all rich people aren’t thieving assholes” moral was just so juvenile and distracting. I get it. Andrew Carnegie and the Rockefellers were good people that helped to build this country.

            I have no problem with hypercapitalist critiques of counter-culture; I just don’t want them in my fucking Batman movies, partially because of the inept handling they displayed. My problem with TDKR is that it repositions Batman as an almost aristocratic figure, above the people, fighting more to maintain the status quo than to make Gotham better. The first film was about Batman as an idealist, The Dark Knight was about Batman facing the harsh reality of the new world he created, and this last film was about Batman’s spirit finally being crushed and accepting Gotham for what it is. In the end, he rides off in to the sunset and leaves John Blake to take the reigns because he knows he didn’t really stop anything with Bane, just delayed it a little longer.

            It was bad. It was as beholden to the flashy toys and ridiculous plot contrivances as any Joel Schumacher movie (Batman resets a fractured vertebrae by hanging haphazardly in a sling!). I think people just got so caught up in dark and gritty and Anne Hathaway’s tight spandex that they couldn’t get past any of that to see that it was legitimately a bad movie. I also believe people feel obligated to think more highly of any movie that has a run time that exceeds two and a half hours, confusing aimless for epic. I’m not saying it’s the worst movie in the franchise, Batman & Robin will always hold that distinction, but it certainly wasn’t near the top (and it was definitely below both Burton movies).

          • Sirand

            I like both the Burton AND Nolan movies. So there.

            Granted, I think Nolan’s trilogy is masterful and the best comic adaptations ever put to film. Burton’s films I find merely fun but in a removed carnival way (they’re NOT Batman films).

            And to chime in on Begins, I will say that leaving Ra’s to die was the one out-of-character moment and the only thing that made cry “Bullshit!” in Nolan’s series.

          • AngryChairr

            To clarify: I think Nolan’s first two Batman movies were masterful, and the best in the series. It’s only TDKR that I think is bad.

          • Terminal

            Begins is the best of the series, while TDKR is a very close second. TDK is fantastic, but doesn’t hold up to the first and third film for me.

          • Terminal

            It’s really tough to watch Burton’s Bat movies. They’re so flawed it’s hard to enjoy at times. Burton has so little respect and regard for Bruce Wayne and the persona of Batman, they can’t even be called Batman movies at all, really.

          • Terminal

            TDKR is a masterful finale from Nolan. I completely disagree. I felt Bane was incredibly menacing and much more horrifying than the Joker. While the Joker was always two steps ahead of everyone, Bane had a menace to him that made him seem almost beyond human. Catwoman’s inclusion is also wonderful as the anti-hero dividing herself between greed and loyalty. And the finale is just excellent filled with ambiguity and a final scene left up to the audience to decide.

            Granted, the final scene of “Is Bruce alive or did he die?” feels like Warner pressured Nolan to leave the door open for reboots and sequels, but the film as a whole is superb and a near masterpiece.

            If I were a Batman fanatic I’d definitely cherish these films. No Batman film I’ve ever seen is flawless, but Nolan’s trilogy is miles beyond Burton/Schumacher’s own in terms of acting, writing, design, etc.

          • conundrum

            “Nolan’s live action films were the definitive adaptation.”

            I would never take anything away from Nolan’s movies. in my opinion he combines two okay and one great movie to make a very good trilogy (which I honestly would not have called a trilogy until the third one, damn did he tie the first two movies together there). But that is NOT the Batman of the comics. “World’s Greatest Detective”; in Nolan’s movies I can only imagine this means Alfred, because Bruce is only interested in thinking as much as it can get him to the next person to punch.

            And while I am calling him Bruce, that is who he was; Bruce Wayne. Batman Beyond got this aspect of the character on the nose. He is not Bruce Wayne, he is Batman. Bruce Wayne is the secret identity he maintains to allow Batman to exist. In Nolan’s movies he is looking for an excuse to give up being Batman.

            Joker killing Batman’s parents – bad idea. The League of Shadows implying they killed Bruce’s parents – almost equally dumb. I mean really, their reasoning was “this city is corrupt and has to be destroyed. Oh, wait, maybe it’s not too corrupt to be saved. Well, better kill the non-corrupt people that way it becomes so corrupt that we have to go in and clean it up.”

            Bruce’s love interest? First, I pin that squarely on Goyer. All movies he writes seem to have a love interest, no matter how tacked on (Blade II). This arguably goes back to the point that Nolan’s main character is Bruce, not Batman, but it once again has Bruce wishing he could get out of this crimefighting hobby and just settle down.

            I hate that they went to the Spiderman movie well of everyone knows who Batman is. Figuring out who Batman is in the comics is worthy of getting a character upgraded to a top tier in the rogues gallery, or maybe even getting to be Robin. In Nolan’s movies, if you stand still long enough Bruce will just let you know eventually.

            Let me be clear; I enjoyed Nolan’s movies. The Dark Knight is a great movie (and I do not throw that term around lightly). But none of the characters are great adaptations of their comic counterparts. It is not, at least in my opinion, a great adaptation. They are amazing for what they are, they fall short as faithful adaptations.

          • LSD Zombie

            You make a very valid point about Joe Chill’s purpose. Still, with all the issues that Burton’s films have, they’re a fun departure from the ultra-serious, ultra-realistic Gotham universe that Nolan created. I’ll take wonderfully crafted sets and Keaton NOT talking like a throat cancer patient over Chicago and Bale’s Batman. I’d say if it weren’t for Heath Ledger’s Joker, Aaron Eckart’s Two-Face, and Tom Hardy’s Bane, the Nolan-verse wouldn’t be nearly as captivating. I also can’t forget Michael Caine and Gary Oldman.

        • Terminal

          Agreed with you, Buz. 100 percent. There’s nothing redeemable about Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. It’s more self serving indulgent Tim Burton crapola tailored for his audience convinced everything he puts out is whimsical brilliance. He hires his best friend and his wife yet again with performances forced down our throats, the added back story for Wonka is horrible, the aesthetic and whimsy feels incredibly forced and generic almost like Burton is imitating Burton, and the movie tries to be “edgy” and fails horribly. It’s barely even entertainment.

  • Foywonder

    For those of you that want to avoid having certain movies and TV shows spoiled here are time stamps for the spoiler sections:

    Bait 3D – 04:40-08:30
    Resident Evil: Retribution 3D – 12:25-16:20
    Dredd 3D – 18:50-26:00
    House at the End of the Street – 26:20-31:22
    Sinister – 38:50-51:30
    American Horror Story – 52:00-54:20
    The Walking Dead & Supernatural – 54:20-64:20
    Smiley – 65:00-71:50
    Paranormal Activity 4 – 72:00-86:50
    Among Friends – 86:55-89:55
    Silent Hill: Revelations 3D – 90:00-100:05
    The Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn Part 2 – 105:45-114:20

  • Rob

    The MP3 version of this is saying it’s corrupted. Any chance for a re-upload?

    • Uncle Creepy

      Reuploaded. Let me know if this works for you.

      • Rob

        It’s still being weird with some programs, but the re-upload works with Quicktime, so I can listen to it. Thanks!